Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monsters

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The Green Herring
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Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monsters

Post by The Green Herring »

Recently, an issue was brought up on the Doom Wiki regarding an addition made to the article on UV max, clarifying that "killing every monster at least once" includes monsters resurrected by an arch-vile. The person who questioned it asked what the editor's source was for that addition. I had to point out that this addition is true, and that Adam Hegyi himself clarified this.

The problem: On the old site, the only place where Hegyi did it was on the forum, which can no longer be read without registering for an account. Even on the new site, this does not appear in the FAQ or the rules page. The only place you can learn about Hegyi clarifying this is this Doomworld post.

My suggestion for UV max and UV -fast is to at least go into "Q: What are the requirements in the categories?" and add "(including monsters resurrected by an arch-vile)" after every instance of "killing every monster at least once," which includes the variants of those two for Episode and Movie runs.

I originally brought this up to fx via e-mail, but I'm posting it here as well so that other people can weigh in on this matter.
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fx
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by fx »

I agree that this should be altered but I wonder what should we do with "old" demos where we have arch-vile's? Will they be beatable? Should we move them somewhere? I'd like more comments about this.
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Archy
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by Archy »

Old demos should remain but all newer must fallow the "new" rules. If the record is LV11-245 but mist a monster, a player submitting a LV11-246 would be valid because the previous entry was Invalid.

Again, just leave them on the site, just as how Steffen Winterfeldt's and Uwe Girlich's cheated demos remain on the site.
Grazza
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by Grazza »

fx wrote:I agree that this should be altered but I wonder what should we do with "old" demos where we have arch-vile's?
If you mean Max/Fast demos where people left monsters alive due to confusion over this point of the rules, then there shouldn't be any demos of this type in the current Compet-n database. I don't believe AdamH allowed any demos of this type, since there was never any change in the rules, just an imprecise statement of them that he later clarified.

When stating the rules, the bit about "killed at least once" should be dropped in favour of a clearer wording. The point isn't how many times they have been killed and rekilled, but that they are dead when exiting the map.

Of course, there are some demos where using modern tools (that Adam didn't have in the old days) we can see that they are not a valid Max. In those cases they clearly should not be regarded as current records.
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by fx »

Ok, didn't realize that the problem was just with the rules/words. I thought that he allowed such demos. Ok, I'll change rules since I was now able to find Adam's post on old forum.

Adam_H wrote:If there's no archie you kill everything except lost souls and finish up with 100%. If there are some monsters which can't be killed by any means then you ignore them.
If there's an archie and it resurrects monsters then you MUST kill the resurrected monsters and if they get resurrected again then you MUST kill them again until there's no one alive.
When you exit there can't be any monsters alive wandering, be that resurrected or non-resurrected (except lost souls or unkillable).
If there are any ghosts created then you MUST kill them until there's none of them, however if by level flaw ghosts don't appear (when by design they should), then you don't have to wait for them to appear (see HR26 discussion).
So, case closed and faq updated!
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Archy
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by Archy »

I can't access the old forum and I've tried registering but it hasn't worked. Any way we post-2005 kids could view the old COMPET-N forum?
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by fx »

Well, since you requested, I'l make it available here. No registration needed, read only. But later today, gotta work now.
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by Archy »

Thank you very much, I've always wanted to see the old COMPET-N forums.
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by fx »

Done, it's working, registration is "disabled" (I've deleted registration file doh ). Guest can see everything. Have fun ^^
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by Archy »

Fx, you may want to take a look at this:
http://www.mywot.com/en/scorecard/searchmagnified.com

Here your first link to "bookmarks" redirects to that website. Doesn't look safe.

EDIT: Never-mind, I thought that was a recent post (it was posted in 2003, lol), don't change ANYTHING on the archived forum.
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by Archy »

In the old forum, Adam_H's profile shows up as "fx."

This will be very confusing in a couple of years.
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Re: Compet-n UV max/-fast rules: Regarding resurrected monst

Post by fx »

yeh i had to "crack" adam's/admins profile to get his password so I can alter some things. I've changed it now to "Admin".
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